16 comments to “Britain’s success in cat management, highlights our own failings”

  1. Debbie Edwards | January 21, 2012 | Permalink

    So Shel, just some clarification here please on your last paragraph. How am I supporting the idea that ‘street cats’ are beyond compassion when the story you have taken my comments from relate to advocating for cat owners to keep their cats safe by containing them on their own properties?

    I am also confused about how your comment ‘we’ve chosen vilification, abuse and killing for the cats of our community’ relates to me advocating for keeping cats contained to ensure their safety. By isolating my comments, you are not giving the full picture on what the story that was being reported on, is about, instead highlighting the problems that cats cause when they wander which sounds like they are being vilified by me.

    In a perfect world, cats would be able to wander where they like and live free of harassment, all cat lovers would support that however, not everyone is a cat lover. That is the reality of the situation and whilst there are people who do not like cats, it is up to us to advocate for their safety by promoting and supporting keeping them contained, ensuring their environmental needs are met so they are happy.

    Advocating for the rights of cats to live free of harassment requires getting people to ignore the nuisance factors, not mind cats killing wildlife and changing cat haters into cat lovers, big asks I’d say and not easily achievable . I will continue to advocate for cat safety by supporting and promoting containment, because as a cat lover, I feel this is the right thing to do.

  2. Nicole Grant | January 21, 2012 | Permalink

    Perhaps,instead of taking a select couple of paragraphs for your own cause, publish the whole article from Debbie Edwards. Debbie is a well known and incredibly respected animal advocate in Bendigo and Central Victoria. What she was aiming for was to let people know that this ‘sick person’ IS out there and you need to keep your animals safe. I would encourage people who may be blind sided by your one sided comments to visit Debbie’s site and all that she stands for.

    What I find sad is that you’ve chosen to work against her when I would have thought all animal agency’s would prefer to work together. The fact that many cats are destroyed annually is the result of either the cats not being microchipped, therefore owners can’t be contacted, not being collected by the owner or not being purchased by individuals who are wanting a cat.

    That they are euthanased is sad beyond belief, but sadly, because of irresponsible owners, the RSPCA becomes overcrowded.

  3. savingpets | January 21, 2012 | Permalink

    Words drive belief. Language is powerful.

    When we use the language of those who hate cats – when we apologise for these cats’ existence, galvanise those people who find their precence annoying by repeating their grievances and especially if we encourage people to take action against free-roaming cats, there has been and will be only one result – more cats in pounds.

    Animal welfare groups have to change their negative language around cats. They have to offer more progressive solutions than ‘catch it and kill it’. But most of all, they have stop thinking that a dead cat is somehow better off than a healthy, free-roaming cat and that killing is some kind of kindness…

    Debbie Edwards: Advocating for the rights of cats to live free of harassment requires getting people to ignore the nuisance factors, not mind cats killing wildlife and changing cat haters into cat lovers, big asks I’d say and not easily achievable.

    Imagine for one moment, any other advocacy group saying a sentence like this; our mission is hard, so instead of building up the community’s compassion for victims, we’re going to campaign instead about their least desirable traits. We’re going to side with the perpetrators.

    It would never happen. Child protection groups don’t bad mouth young offenders. Women’s shelters don’t use the language of abusers. And yet here we are, the frontline cat advocates promoting intolerance to cats; … there’s nothing worse than the smell of cat poo.

    Encouraging people to keep their cats indoors for their safety and to reduce any impact on neighbours is a *good* thing. Catmax’s are awesome. Indoor cats are awesome. But there is absolutely no need to run down the cat to make this an effective message…

    Nicole Grant: The fact that many cats are destroyed annually is the result of either the cats not being microchipped, therefore owners can’t be contacted, not being collected by the owner or not being purchased by individuals who are wanting a cat.

    This is utterly and completely false. The fact so many cats are destroyed annually is because healthy, free-roaming, untame strays are impounded by animal welfare groups who offer these cats no other option other than to be killed.

    While it feels good to bogey-man with the ‘irresponsible owner’meme, if you spend any time at all looking at the research surrounding cat population dynamics, you’d know the Australian stray cat population is self-sustaining and has probably been so since our arrival and urbanisation of Australia. Even if we could stop every owned cat from going stray, and stop every owned cat from having kittens – IT WOULD MAKE NO DIFFERENCE to the ‘stray’ cat population.

    The point of this post is that while we act as apologists to the cat haters and work against all hope to see all cats indoors; other countries have realised that the solution is to build up the reputation of the cat, defend their right to live free from harrassment like any other community member and support those who people compassionate enough to care for them.

    That is what leads to less killing. Not chasing some mythical future where all cats are responsibly kept indoors.

  4. Melissa Langford | January 23, 2012 | Permalink

    I feel you should apologise to Debbie Edwards, her comments have been taken way out of context. Perhaps you should have a look at the good she has done for cats here in Bendigo. It was BAWCS who brought the Strathdale cat killer issue to the attention of residents and the media. Debbie/BAWCS have never endorsed the actions of the Strathdale cat hater and they have tried to spread the word about responsible cat ownership. In Australia native animal and bird numbers have been decimated by introduced species such as cats, dogs, and rabbits. You cannot compare the situation in rural/regional Australia with that of England, it is comparing apples with oranges. I keep my cats in a large 75sqm enclosure, that way they are safe as is native wildlife. It is also worth noting that many local governments in Australia have strict cat curfews and some areas do require by law that cats are confined. I am a cat lover and it really upsets me when animal groups attack each other. In nursing (where I work) this is called horizontal violence. Lets support the work of those who help cats and hope that the Strathdale cat hater is caught and held to account for his/her anti-social and unacceptable actions.

  5. savingpets | January 23, 2012 | Permalink

    As far as I know, Debbie isn’t challenging the reporter as having misquoted her, so I don’t really understand how she is being taken ‘out of context’. In what ‘context’ is it ok for a cat advocate to say;

    “Cats are highly-developed hunters, they do kill things, and they can be noisy. No one wants to wake up to the sound of cats fighting.”

    “And if you’re a gardener you don’t want to be digging up cat poo, there’s nothing worse than the smell of cat poo. ”


    In what ‘context’ is it appropriate for the person advocating in the public domain FOR cats, to run off a checklist of why people-who-don’t-like-cats, might think they suck? What a fabulous advertisement for kindness & tolerance toward them!

    I’m also tickled by this idea that Australia is the only country with sensitive fauna; that the UK isn’t host to its own songbirds & small mammals. (That New Zealand & US animal groups also support TNR I guess is irrelevant; they must not have native animals either)… and that we are also unique in that unlike every other situation involving cat control – we’re different – we’re going to buck the trend of the ineffective and unending trap and kill programs & they’re going to work for us. Even though ineffective and unending trap and kill programs haven’t worked in the several decades to date in which we’ve *been* trying them. Certainly, we shouldn’t try anything new, as good intentions count as much as actual, tangible results.

    I would apologise for my ‘attack’ one hundred times over if it would help a single cat from being impounded and killed. But if history has taught us anything, it’s that everyone singing kumbaya has gotten us nowhere in making pounds and shelters safer for animals, so for now we’ll just have to agree to disagree.

  6. Julie | January 26, 2012 | Permalink

    Debbie Edwards and others perpetuate and enable the cat-hating mentality that seems to be far more prevalent in Australia than any other country I’ve lived in. The threat to wildlife by cats has been grossly exaggerated by the media and others. It’s time for Australia to change from being 20-30 years behind the rest of the advanced world where animal welfare is concerned. Stop enabling and justifying cat haters and animal abusers. Adopt progressive strategies used overseas to improve the welfare of all cats and dogs and stop the endless unnecessary killing of these animals in this country.

  7. Melissa Langford | January 29, 2012 | Permalink

    AGAIN, why don’t you publish the whole article??? I never used the word “misquote” so be careful when replying to comments. As far as the cat “suck” comments go, as I see it cats are hunters, cats make noise, cats poo in gardens and cats kill things. If you can find evidence to the contrary please publish it here. I love cats and again am saying you should come here to Bendigo to see the good that BAWCS does for cats. Your selective cherrypicking of quotes from Debbie is misleading to say the least.

  8. savingpets | January 29, 2012 | Permalink

    As a blogger I’m not legally able to republish the entire article. What I can do (and what I have done) is to highlight a section I feel important & link to the full article. You may feel this displays the comments ‘out of context’, but I feel there is no context which calls us to run down the very victim we’re supposed to be working to generate compassion for.

    I am very familiar with Debbie’s work and the fact she is the frontline representative for cat welfare in the area, makes her comments more damaging than if they were uttered by someone less important to the cause.

    It is distressing to me that rather than acknowledge what seems to be a no brainer – that championing cats’ worst traits & advocating their removal, may be detrimental to our cause to see less of them killed in pounds – that this has become about a personal effort to thwart discussion & review. We need to be putting thought into our messages, put the animals ahead of egos and look critically at our efforts compared to other more successful countries, if we’re ever to improve the situation for cats.

  9. Melissa Langford | January 30, 2012 | Permalink

    Your own continued efforts to stop discussion are noted. Just because others (like myself) support containment (where cats are safe from cars, dogs, humans, FIV etc) does not mean that we are anti-cat. I cannot understand your thinking. On what planet does everyone love cats and cat behaviour? On what planet are all pet owners responsible and get their pets desexed? How can you cherrypick comments from an article and then refuse to show people any of the context (very convenient excuse btw)? I think the answer to the numbers of unwanted animals in pounds is desexing and education, what do others think?

  10. savingpets | January 30, 2012 | Permalink

    Stop discussion? How so?

    No one has said all cat owners are responsible. No one has said their behaviour is always desirable. What I said was;

    “…championing cats’ worst traits & advocating their removal, may be detrimental to our cause to see less of them killed in pounds.”

    Desexing owned pets is lovely. Educating owners is lovely. But neither have any effect – no. effect. whatsoever. – on the self-sustaining unowned and stray population.

    Until cat advocates start to look – really actually look – at the science of cat population dynamics and start championing those ideas and programs which *work* to reduce cat impoundments (whether they be local, or international), we will remain stuck killing cats verbatim.

    If you can show me a single instance – just one – from anywhere in the world – where desexing owned animals and ‘educating’ owners has resulted in a significant reduction in the numbers of cats killed in pounds, then I’ll blog & sing their success from the rooftops! Just as I have done here with this example of truly successful cat management from the UK – where they have just found the solution to the wholesale slaughter of cats – and which disappointingly seems to have been missed as the point of this post. Their thinking works: our thinking doesn’t. Whether we like it or not – whether we mean well or not – whether we want to believe it or not – our current approach is killing cats.

  11. Melissa Langford | February 1, 2012 | Permalink

    I’m over this. MLK “championed” black rights, Debbie stated the bleeding obvious. You are not making a clear enough link between your sweeping statments about cats, cat haters, and the subject of the comments YOU didn’t like – which was about the Strathdale cat killer and not about cats in far flung countries. You should reference your statistics and it wouldn’t hurt you to have a look at The Project from last Monday which had a segment about blogging that is probably relevant for you. I think you mean well but you can’t expect everyone to agree with you and think you are wonderful. You also call for comments then and deride every comment that you personally don’t like. I support 3 local no kill animal welfare groups that take animals off the streets and out of death row at the pound. I don’t support people who make offensive claims about animal advocates being labelled “apologists for cat haters” and saying that they have chosen vilification, abuse and killing. Yuck.

  12. savingpets | February 1, 2012 | Permalink

    I don’t expect everyone to agree with me ;) What’s more, I’ve given you the opportunity and forum to disagree with me – provide evidence that in fact the current approach being used by cat advocates – the one you’re defending – is showing benefit to the cats here in Australia…

    However simply saying ‘I think you’ve taken her out of content’ – and – ‘I don’t think you’re right to make a connection between local an international issues’ doesn’t really add anything to the debate.

    You are obviously welcome to think whatever you like, but if you’re going to voice these beliefs, here in the discussion there has to be more to it than ‘I think…’

  13. Melissa Langford | February 1, 2012 | Permalink

    You go off on a lot of unrelated tangents, don’t provide any referencing for your claims, ignore any comment you choose and I just don’t get what is going on in your head. Debbie’s comments were in response to multiple media requests and related to someone posting an offensive notice at a local shopping centre. Perhaps you would like to give all of us an example of what you would say to the media if asked to comment about this particular incident??? Also, I did not say “I think you’ve taken her out of context” – I am telling you directly that you have taken comments out of context ,you have refused to reference your original post, and you still refuse to provide a tangible link between feral cat management in the UK and a particular individual in Strathdale trapping/killing wandering pets.

  14. savingpets | February 1, 2012 | Permalink

    Cat groups in the UK advocate ‘leaving them alone as the best option’ and the UK impound & kill very few cats.

    Cat groups here “fully support people’s right to use cat traps” and Australia impound and kill tens of thousands of cats annually.

    And there’s no connection you can see? None at all?

  15. Melissa Langford | February 2, 2012 | Permalink

    So knowing that some vile person in Strathdale is trapping and killing pets you tell the media that? Seriously?? Did you ignore the question or do you just hope that the person in Strathdale who advertises breaking the law will simply “leave them alone”?? I didn’t say no connection, I expect a tangible and verifiable connection between two quite different issues, not just assumptions. It’s interesting that you are so critical of others comments relating to the Strathdale cat killer but can’t give an example of what exactly would be an acceptable comment to the media! Also you go off and say that the UK impounds and kills very few cats but again this is just your word and I have no idea if that is really true. I have better things to do with my time than this, if you want to work against other animal welfare organisations that’s your choice. Personally I believe that a lot more would be achieved if animal lovers put aside minor issues, watched their manners, kept a check on their egos and then worked together to promote animal welfare.

  16. savingpets | February 2, 2012 | Permalink

    No fair enough – I should give an example of what to do, rather than just what *not* to do.

    Here’s what *not* to say, as a cat advocate speaking to the media, when asked about a rogue cat trapper in the neighbourhood;

    (Bendigo Animal Welfare and Community Services president Debbie Edwards) said she empathised with people who were plagued by nuisance cats.

    “Cats are highly-developed hunters, they do kill things, and they can be noisy. No one wants to wake up to the sound of cats fighting,” she said.

    “And if you’re a gardener you don’t want to be digging up cat poo, there’s nothing worse than the smell of cat poo. I fully support people’s right to use cat traps, but we don’t support the destruction of cats, that is against the law.”


    Here are the kinds of things which could be said – there are suggestions for keeping cats safe, but doesn’t run down cats as a species or side with the trappers;

    – As we care for cats, we recommend cats are kept on their owners property, are brought inside at night and that you monitor that your pet isn’t bothering your neighbours.

    – Better yet, get one of those fantastic ‘Cat Max’s’ or outdoor enclosures so you can keep your pet safe at all times.

    – We condemn the use of cat traps, as trapping cats doesn’t address the underlying issues of open rubbish bins, rodent infestations and easily accessible pet food, that tends to act as a cat attractants. It also puts pets at risk of abuse and death in a pound.

    – We include on our website a list of easily implemented deterrents that people can use if they want to keep cats off their property. http://communitycats.com.au/keep-cats-out-of-my-garden/

    – We also offer free cat desexing to any cat lover caring for a free-roaming or ‘community cat’. Desexing is beneficial to cat health and helps stabilise the population.

    – We encourage anyone who wants assistance with cats in their area to contact us for help.

    Develop an information sheet for people who ring for assistance that you can post or email. See some of the great resources at Alley Cat Allies http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=679
    or my own website http://www.http://communitycats.com.au/

    :)